Episode 25, Alena Bennett, Senior Finance Leadership Coach

Alena Bennett is a chartered accountant with international public practice in corporate experience.

She's a trained educator, and a published author. Alena is the go to the senior finance leaders looking for the next level of success.

If you would like to chat you can contact her on 0451 541 481 or email alena@alenabennett.com.au

To find out more about her work click on http://www.alenabennett.com

To contact Richard Holmes please call 0403 513 720 or reach out on richardh@hprconsulting.com. https://www.linkedin.com/in/richardholmesfinancerecruiter/

Transcript

Please note that this has been transcribed by AI/Bots so there may be typos and the occasional strange things happening.
 
Richard Holmes

0:00
Welcome to the numbers people Podcast, where each week, we're going to be speaking with some highly regarded senior finance professionals and create experts looking into the ins and outs of what makes finance people and their teams bright. The podcast is proudly sponsored by HPR consulting, a leading executive finance recruitment firm. I'm your host, Richard Holmes.

On today's episode, we welcome Alena Bennett. Alena is a chartered accountant with international public practice in corporate experience. She's a trained educator, and a published author. Alana is the go to the senior finance leaders looking for the next level of success.

Alena Bennett
0:41
Alena, great to have you on the show. Good to see you again. How have you been? Yeah, really? Well. Thanks, Richard. Yeah, it's a busy time of year, but really exciting time of year, especially for CFOs. And their teams, certainly is excited in the finance world. And just prior to, to this recording, we say business is going well. And 2021 is looking to be a good year. What's positive? Yeah, I think what happened last year, and you know, I guess this translates into sort of how will businesses going but I think last year really put CFOs in the spotlight. And when I say that, you kind of look around the room of CFOs. And some of them think, yeah, it's a spotlight, but it's a bit of a hot seat. But I think obviously, given what we've all gone through over the past 15 months or so as we've got a lot of companies that financial performance, survival, sustainability, and what that looks like for the future has changed significantly. And CEOs a route and boards are really looking to the CFO to help drive that value and sort of get them out of the ditch. And what I'm seeing is that companies are going from survival into growth mode or stabilization into growth mode pretty quickly. They need the CFO to do that. And so I think that you know, I think this is a really big opportunity for CFOs to shine, which I think so exciting. Definitely, I think our complete agreement with the clients, we work with the hedge power, we've seen that way it's we're transitioning into a growth period, I think we survive, majority of companies vibed really well. And it's been a learning for all stressful times for a lot of people.

Alena Bennett
2:10
Current ability, and that's what the call is, yeah. It's ripping the band-aid off a lot of companies, I think it really exposed underlying performance. And I think this is where the opportunity is for CFOs and their team to add value and really be able to translate what does that performance mean? And where are the opportunities to drive further value for the team? So I think it's great. It's good to hear the sentiment, although it's just sort of moving forward, isn't it? Yeah, it's happened.
Richard Holmes

2:40
Yes. an exciting time in public, I would say if I was that they're all enjoying it. It's like some of them have come back. refreshed. And

Alena Bennett

2:50
it's a good time to be a good time to be in finance. Yeah, I think so. I work in the industry. But I see a lot of people are engaged in optimistic. Well, I kind of think that you know, this scenario of a business, that's sort of been a little bit unloved. I think one of the things and so they're probably a little bit cheeky for me to say this, but you know, finance is a cost center. The cost, it's a cost center that manages billions of dollars of portfolio of balance sheet, p&l, restaurants, I get that there's not a sales element to finance. But can you really consider the finance function of cost center?
AB
Alena Bennett

3:24
When it's your finance, custodian, or the rest of it? So yeah, I think this is this. You know, I'll say it again, this is the opportunity to shine your touch on the value that finance cloud, I think it's really the actual function has gone from the back office to very much integral cog. Yeah, we've had those conversations a lot. Since we touched on earlier before, before recording this, they might see if I was going into CEO roles is evidence of that.
Richard Holmes

3:51
And with with the nature of your work as well, you touched on a lot in terms of leadership coaching. And you mentioned your launch in your CFO boardroom. Yes, the next one is exciting, which is a very exciting. Yeah, I will actually and maybe we'll talk about a little bit more towards the end as well. But you know, I suppose what I've seen and and particularly Now, given that we're starting to come back into the office, we're really excited to go what my coach actually calls belly to belly, I won't say that that's my term, that's a term that she uses. But the CFO boardroom really is giving CFOs that opportunity to connect and get belly to belly with their peers who really understand their challenges. It's an extension of the CFO Connect series, which is a breakfast series, I also run but this, which really is just here, what I find is that CFOs getting the room and they just almost exhale and just kind of can let themselves let their guards down a little bit and go, this is what's really going on and they sort of sit there and wonder and think I should do more of this, but I just don't make the time and you know, so the CFO boardroom really brings the best of the best in terms of an executive coaching engagement plus the connection and development of

Alena Bennett

5:00
a community of a group of CFOs that you know, sort of become your power base is the term I call, so you've got them on speed dial, you also have their advisors and suppliers and all the rest of it on speed dial as well. And I kind of feel like part of my role there is really changing the face of finance, but the CFOs, you know, really shifting the perception of what it means to be a CFO. And we know that the perception of the CFO is changing, but there's still a little bit of old school, Old World in there. And so I think, one of the telling bits for me, and why I'm so excited about doing this and really focusing on what it means to be CFO now, and the CFO of the future, is I still get people say to me, I'm not your typical CFO. And the reason why they think they're not a typical CFOs because they care about people, they want to add value, and they want to partner with the CEO.

Alena Bennett

5:52
Now, I reckon that's just to see their CFO, but yet, every single person, they will tell I'm not typical, say, buddy. So I think Well, how do we turn that into this typical CFO, we get those CFOs in a room and we, you know, lift the, you know, the rising tide, we lift the ships together. So that's that's really what the CFO boardroom is about a high performance coaching program. This is really exciting. And looking. After the show in the in the notes for this podcast, we'll put the details to the boardroom. And today, we're going to talk about some of the pillars of woman Yes. See if I was doing in 2021. Yes. And I think it's really interesting content, what you've got, and again, we'll put the links yet to we're going to have a chat bot.

Alena Bennett

6:37
So we'd like to, yeah, absolutely. So maybe I'll just start a little bit with, with my background, and just sort of where I've come in sort of why I've now certainly put myself in, in this place. I've gone from how I describe, I've gone from bean counter to business partner to business owner. And we know that the concept of a business partner and the concept of back office, they're not new concepts. But I suppose with my own experience, and my own background, I've now seen the impact the real impact of what it means to be a business partner and a business owner into where that commercial hat. You know, I think about my best days back at KPMG, which is where I started, both here. And in the US, I was really evident to me the positive impact that leadership had on team performance. And it was, you know, in order, you're exposed to hundreds and hundreds of different teams, different finance functions. And the question you're always asking yourself is what I want to work in this company? The answer is usually no. And that is the cause of leadership. And I suddenly became obsessed with what's the impact of the partner on the rest of the team and the ability to keep utilization rates, profitability rates and retention rates, then I've moved into corporate and that obsession sort of continued, internally. And what I saw is that the dynamic of a corporate team is slightly different. But again, there was still this direct relationship between the leadership and leadership capability, the CFO, and its effectiveness of the team, and the dysfunction of that finance leadership team level became really evident. And I, gosh, it's it's crazy to me to think about the amount of inefficiency, that's great as a result of negative leadership, the amount of

Alena Bennett

8:21
recruitment causes that are wasted as a result of, you know, unnecessary turnover. Gosh, wouldn't it be great if you could just, you know, solve the root cause of the problem. And, you know, sort of focus on that leadership skills. And so I understand why that's come about, you know, we spoke earlier about sort of where we are in terms of a generation and a different demographic, when we were the young bean counters, you know, command and control was very much still a thing. And over time, over the last few decades, we've seen that landscape of leadership change. And that's really exciting. But a lot of the leaders haven't changed with that. And so this is where we have, you know, the most we have not only the multiple generations, but we have the multiple different styles of leadership in place. And so how I got into this world, I didn't know this world existed. That was simply you're sitting in a leadership team, strategy day, and I saw a facilitator doing their thing. And I literally was like, I went back to a five year old I met. That's what I want to do when I grow up. And it was fast. I know, no clue. This is what this whole world existed. So I pulled him aside and I said, look

Alena Bennett

9:31
at the chat.

Alena Bennett

9:33
Because I should point out that until now, I've literally just been following my nose in terms of what I want to do. I was a good girl and the eldest child so I kind of did all the right things. I went did the commerce degree when it's a big fall when overseas, did all those things. And this was that moment.

Alena Bennett

9:51
I want to do that. Anyway, long story short, I was I was given the opportunity to come out of corporate and do a project with

Alena Bennett
10:00
a consultant that I was working with at the time. So you know, we all have a soft landing. So I did that. And it was probably the first time I've been really intentional with my own career. And I look back now, and I think, gosh, all of those things I did in my finance career really set me up for this this point. And I think that is one of the beauties of finance is it does give you that broad lens of what it means to be in corporate. So it does open up a lot of opportunities. But my first 12 months outside of corporate was away from finance. At that time, I realized it rekindled my love of fondness for finance, because I really think it's an area that's um, nurtured and a little bit on love. And coming back to my comment around CFOs, and not the typical finance person who actually just human beings. And so I kind of went, you know, what, that's it, this is, this is my purpose, it's about helping, you know, finance professionals play their biggest game, you know, have the impact and influence they want to have deliver the value they want. And know they can, in this changing landscape, and, you know, really become the strategic leaders of businesses. So that sort of, and I kind of feel like having gone through, one of the things I laugh about is I thought I was a really good business partner when I was in corporate. And then I became a business owner, and I went, I had no, I had no idea what it what it meant to be a business partner. And so I can't now I look back with all of my experience and go great, I'm really well positioned now to sort of walk alongside CFOs and their teams, and really help them manage the difference and increasing demands, what it means to be a CFO and a finance professional today.

Richard Holmes
11:39
Yeah, that's, that's great. Just listening to you, though. I mean, it's, it's a good story. five year old, that's what I want to do. Yes. And just listening to that, I've been through the course of doing this podcast, a lot of the guests never wanting to be in the content, never can because back then it was still stereotypical things in the pocket. And it looked really fucking the image of finances changing. People like yourself, go to

Alena Bennett
12:09
Absolutely. Yes. And with opportunity comes challenge true, because what we have seen is that the remit of the CFO has grown exponentially. And it always was growing exponentially via data analytics, we had strategy, we had change management, there really became a part of the CFOs job and then pandemic came. And suddenly, with the cash flow forecasts, suddenly CFOs were heavily involved in workforce planning, you know, making the decisions around who needs to be let go stood down, you know, how do we put through redundancy provision through the p&l and all the rest of it, and I think so then last year, not only for from a cognitive perspective, in terms of the cognitive load of the CFO was growing that emotional load that was really tested as well last year. And so I think what we're seeing and you know, it continues to, it continues to evolve that challenge of the result of the pandemic, the government incentives, now the release of their late recent budget. And what that now means is, that role of the CFO continues to increase. I was doing some AR, I am doing research for my book that's coming out this year for CFOs. And part of that research is obviously information gathering around what you know, sort of various research firm things, that their capabilities and skills that a CFO needs to have for the future. I think I'm up to about 20 publications over 100 skills. So for any CFOs that are listening to this podcast, I wish you all the best. And look out for my next book, because I'm going to make it far simpler than having to be across, you know, over 100 skills. But but I think this demonstrates the problem is that the remit is is grind, which is a fabulous opportunity. But it's impossible to do at all. You know, and I think the challenge of time, and that inability to get time and being busy, has always existed. And that just continues to exist. And so then it becomes the question of what is the thing that's going to get me out of the Get me out of the trenches? What is the thing that's going to allow me to elevate to where I want to be. And I think a lot of what we're saying is with teams coming back into the office CFOs are having to redefine what they expect. You've seen this in terms of the candidates that you're interviewing clients that you're working with is because strategies have changed for businesses over the past 15 months, they're saying, wash, my team doesn't fit, will not deliver that strategy, given what the strategy now is. So I now need to redefine what my team is who is in my team, and the culture that we need within the team to drive and deliver that strategy. And again, so So, again, CFOs are now having to be really focused on people and culture. And if we extend on that now now I'm sort of hopping on a little bit, but I think this is this is a reality. The CFO is it's just end end This is the most I'm saying CFOs being seen as the glue within the executive team. They're the people person to galvanize the people. 10 years ago, they were sitting in the corner, come to audit committees to list the financials, you know, talk to the board about financial matters. But now they're being the person that's being brought in by the CEO to say, sort out the mess that's going on. Can you bring everyone together. And again, as someone who loves people, and I know all the clients that I work with, they fundamentally love people too. And so this is the stereotype we need to shift CFOs are perfectly placed, they have objective visibility across all of the business units, all of the functions in the business. And they have the technical capability to go deep into the numbers. And so therefore, they are uniquely placed to identify trends, and identify those performance leaders that really allowed them to lift and go into the future. And I just think it's phenomenal.

Richard Holmes
15:59
Yeah. into just listening to you, though, we've seen job titles and structures, they've changed so much, just in the last few years, where a commercial manager in one company is different to a commercial manager. What is commercial mean? It depending on where you work, it's got different connotations. And, again, with structures, like I said, What organizational structures and say there's a billion dollar company over here, the structures and the amount of people on the team are completely different. Yeah. Who's right? Who's wrong? Absolutely. It's case by case. But it absolutely. There we see some companies with really big commercial teams while another company's competitive with people who say, well, someone's right to the throne. Exactly.

Alena Bennett
16:45
Or does it work? Every company is different, I think, I think you're spot on. So there's a lot going on for a CFO at the moment. And and, you know, I think we'll talk about the five pillars of high performance in a minute, because that is fundamentally how you make sure that all of these spinning plates that you can feel like you're juggling, don't drop. But I think the other thing, and this is, you know, where I love bringing together communities of CFOs together is that there is only one, it's just you. And so they do say it's lonely at the top, I get that. But for a CFO, the CFO is probably the only person that really needs to focus on past performance, historic performance, you know, they hit on the line when it comes to regulatory compliance, but also needs to be seen to be driving the strategic direction of the company and almost be a futurist. So they really want to do and only person in their organization who understands that tension. And I think this is the this is the tension that exists and exists from a very young age, you don't need to be a CFO to feel this tension. But I think, you know, the CFO, you're, you're the face of finance, you've got this tension of that compliance, that will back office via you type work, and the commercial mindset. And I think about sort of the middle. The big metaphor, I work well with images and visuals is the iceberg. So if you think about an iceberg, and you think about the waterline, I was talking about above the waterline below the waterline, above the waterline, everyone can see that that's the sexy stuff, right? That's the stuff we love is the strategy. It's an impact, it's the influence. It's when high performance seats is above the waterline, below the waterline hygiene, it's reporting its governance, its internal controls, it's all of the efficiency stuff within your team. It's where the chunk of your world leaders, but yet most people don't see it, don't care about it. And that that's that real tension. And if we then say, Okay, well, if we've got a tension that exists between what we must do, which is that compliance stuff, the internal stuff, and would love to do, which is the, you know, commercial, external way that people can see, when you add on to that thing, the technical skills, again, that sort of must have skills that you know, everyone listening probably has had got all of those skills in spades. But then you've got your non technical skills, which are those skills that amplify your ability to implement the technical things you need to I think probably most people here probably tried to implement any policy or process or procedure or had to tell someone some bad news that they can't execute a commercial transaction. And you're trying to have this conversation without the other person looking at you just going You're awful. You know, don't be the note Don't be the naysayer. And so, again, so if I'm thinking about, okay, we've got the tension of compliance for commercial and we've got this need to be both technically, it's one and have the non technical skills to back that up. Again, come back to the the skill set that you need. We've got to be we've got to wear our controller szczepan. You've got to be an exceptional team leader. And it's the controller ship and the team leader of elements that sit below the line below the word mind. That's the bit that gets to be Are you done? That is the bit that as a CFO you must have in place in order to fly and elevate. So You can be a strategic leader and a change leader, leader, all of that stuff that sits above the organization. And so I think the key is I've shared this with with clients and so but Eleanor, I need to do it all. Because you actually physically can't do it all. And so then the question I asked them is, then, what is your sequence to success? How and that's effectively what we end up doing is we identify the sequence of success, what do you need now, that will sort you out now, but will also set you up for the future? It's kind of like that analogy of making the plane building the plane while you're flying it. It's a little bit were saved on themselves a lot of the time. But yeah, so it's sort of identifying, which is that which is the quadrant that I need to be focusing on for now. And that's sort of where the energy goes. So it is a complex time to be a CFO yet. The opportunity is there for those who choose to go there play the game?

Richard Holmes
20:57
That's a great question, just stepping back, and what's going to make you succeed? Because I think sometimes we know the business world you're living. I mean, we don't reflect too often. In terms of things. That's wrong. I was talking to someone the other day, we said, we it's pretty sad that we don't celebrate success as much as we did. Like, even in my own business, we used to go out a lot. And then now we don't speak sad, isn't it? But it is not fun to reflect and suppose COVID happened, and given us the time to reflect that's no, it's like a web approach of what's going to make you succeed. Yeah, that's people thinking.

Alena Bennett
21:37
If we link that to high performance, which is what the high performance habits, and the five pillars is all about, let's think about probably something a lot of us are familiar with nets, high performance athletes. What do they do after every race or game, they've watched themselves play or race again, regardless of whether they lose or win. And so when I talk about, we're talking about celebration and celebrating success, I talk about three different types of conversations, you need to have conversations for clarity, making sure there's a shared understanding of something. And conversations for influence, which is about influencing change and moving forward, and then there's conversations to celebrate. Because to your point, every single time I run a workshop, and I ask the teams, what should they be doing more of celebrating success is like the number one thing they say. So everybody knows they should do it, but they died. But I think that's because we perceive celebrations for success to be kind of rah rah, were awesome. But I think if we can shift the perception of what a celebrate conversation to celebrate, to being it's actually celebrating, might be celebrating success or being but it actually might be celebrating the opportunity to learn because we failed. And so I think if we can just think about in really simple terms, we need to have all three types of conversations and building that conversation of sort of celebration or conversations or success into a workplace, then we can cover up both of those elements. Because I think about veering budget time, whatever. That's our grand final sports teams watch their grand final, they've done it, it's it is the way you lift performance. So I know we're digressing slightly, but I thought I look upon that.

Richard Holmes
23:12
That's a great goal. That's the thing is that we are just too caught up in the moment. Totally. Look at what's celebrating. not celebrate the failures. But what did we learn from that? So it's an opportunity for what to learn in finances where we do have pressure on ourselves about making mistakes. So during the course of doing this podcast, is a question. What's been your biggest and majority don't have a big, big failure. It's because I think they've been scared to make correct.

Alena Bennett
23:45
That's right.

Richard Holmes
23:48
Yeah, yeah. But it's, it's viewed so negatively, but we only know what we know. Yeah, that's exactly right. It's interesting as we as we get older and wiser, wiser, and what we do like, it's fascinating report, Hunter. Like, we ask for help. But when we're earlier creates, it's profitable. Yeah, that's
24:08
right. It's
24:09
a goal, riches and always do.
AB
Alena Bennett
24:10
That's exactly right. It's just notes. Yeah. So I think it's up to us to change that perception that
24:17
this was talking about. Yeah,
AB
Alena Bennett
24:19
that's exactly right. If I think about, you know, what, what does high performance mean for a CFO? I think it becomes about being a CFO of influence. I think I see CFOs of influencers being the CFOs of the future. You know, I talked about command and control. That's sort of the other end of the spectrum. And I think if we look at it sort of different levels. So what's the journey to being a CFO of influence? Yeah, let's just ignore command and control and pretend that doesn't exist. But I think there's a level that we're probably all familiar with, and that's the level of firefighting route, see if I was firefighter. Now we all in the world of finance, we find ourselves in a reactive firefighting position at various times of the year just comes with the territory. That's okay. But I think the problem Is it can be without sort of intervention, it can become status quo, that by fighting it can be, while we fight all the time. That's not good, the impact of that normal organization is actually negative. And so I think the My recommendation is, if you find yourself in that space, what you need to do is you just need to stop. So acting counterintuitive to what you think because you're rushing from deadline to deadline, but you actually need to stop and go what's going on here and get clarity on how you move up to the next step. And I think the next step out of firefighting mode is delivery mode. But this is sort of status quo, just deliver what you're supposed to read, this is financial reports, management reports, all of that stuff doesn't set the world on fire. But if you can do that, at the bare minimum, you're probably not going to get into much strife. But again, we're talking about CFOs of the future. They don't want to be stuck delivering. So then they now need to look at Well, you know, what do I What do I need to prioritize in order to lift again, come back to my question, what's your sequence to success? So then we go, then we shift up into what I call the advisor level, which is, I think, really interesting, because we quite often people talk about trusted advisor and trusted partner interchangeably, but I think there's a really important nuance between the two, which is why think advisor sits between deliver and partner advisor. It's great, you know, people are asking you for advice, they're coming to you quite proactively. So suddenly, you're being involved in conversations at the right time, instead of at the last minute, which is what happens if the thing with advice is that people don't need to take it. So they will come and they'll say, Hey, I'm gonna Can I pick your brain? I might just like to know what your thoughts are here. And and they walk around, but I walk out and do whatever they want. Right? So yeah, it feels good for a little while. But then you realize, well, hang on, you still just do what you wanted in the first place. And that is the difference between advisor and partner. Whereas partner, it's likely it's that mutual. We, you know, we hold hands metaphorically, and move forward together, we are peers, I come to you with things with suggestions with concerns and vice versa. And I think that's where most CFOs think the endgame is strategic business partner. And I go, yeah, that's all well and good. But by the time you get to CFO, you mentioned age a little bit, I do think you get to a point where you go, well, it's actually bigger than the job. If we actually start to move from thinking about identity through to legacy. I think that's where you start to think, Okay, well, what do I want this bigger than this, and that's where you go will influence really positive outcomes here. And that's where we move into being a CFO of influence. It's really being connected to purpose, organization, purpose and company. But saying, what is the opportunity for us to thrive? That might be not, not in the here, and now that might be longer term? You know, I think that's where it becomes about vision, it becomes about, you know, real value, perceived bias. I think I think that's sort of those are the steps to get there. And those are the things you need to focus on.

Richard Holmes
27:59
Those are total equivalent terms is about self awareness, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah, is is a bit of a CFO role. It's all encompassing.

Alena Bennett
28:08
It is. And so I think, you know, it's quite, that's why I sort of describe it using those buzzwords is because it can be very easy to go, Oh, that's me. Or what your listeners are probably thinking is, oh, that's where I want to be. That's where I am most of the time. And I do hints like most people got I'm in firefighting, mode and delivery mode. Most of the time, I do get opportunities to be an advisor and partner, but where I want to be is partner touching on influencer. But we also know that any sort of scale or ladder like that is it, it kind of moves like those old stepper machines that just keep moving, that as you as you get up the rank, as you learn, your self awareness goes up, your expectations go up, you go back down to the bottom again. But that's the beauty of growth, right? You constantly get to evolve and grow.

Richard Holmes
28:55
Think I think those those tips as well, are excellent. And again, it comes down to just probably think about it. Yeah. Whether we want to be one of the guts that's unique. And so I mean, the nature market as well. I mean, a lot of great people, I think, should be further ahead than where they are, but they only know what they know. Yes. And spot opportunity as well. Yeah, I mean, this

Alena Bennett
29:22
is and I appreciate it, we still haven't come to the five pillars. So let me let me share those
Richard Holmes
29:26
now. We believe

Alena Bennett
29:27
in we believe the best? Well, no, but I suppose that is useful to talk about, you know, I always say with all the work I do, I want to operate in a context of reality. But there's no point just talking on the sky stuff. So it's, you know, I kind of go let's just be honest, in terms of what's going on there, and then we can figure out what to do about it. The five pillars of performance really are about helping you with that sequence of success. I use it with my clients when we do our strategic planning video. It really becomes this this five pillars to focus on and we think The pillars in terms of not only our 12 month goals, but we break it down to our quarterly goals. What do we need to focus on? When. So if we think about what those five pillars are, you know, I think the easiest one to come to come up with straightaway is the financial or technical pillar. So this might be the sort of my big milestones of deadlines that you have a work, it might be a capital raise, it might be year end and might be budget process, what are the big milestones that you must hit? In order to keep your CEO happy, you're having your shareholders happy? So it's okay, well, what are those? And how does that then influence your priorities for a quarter that we were talking about a quarter, we've then got your professional pillar. So this is me myself, and I see if I want to my professional goals, because that's that broader context. This is how I, you know, how I do what I do, how do I deliver fundamentally, those financial and technical pillars. So those are what like, if you think about house, I think about it, like a house, those are the sort of walls that the professional and the financial pillar, then you have the sort of three supporting pillars that sit under that. And the first supporting pillar is the structural pillar. This is the structures, the rhythms, the routines that you have set up at work, that to help you do what you need to do help you deliver not only your work goals, but your professional goals. This might be, you know, having the right people in the right roles, it might be having every one of your resources, you know, your roles field, it might be having the right corporate hierarchy. It may also extend to your work rhythms and routines, how many times are you meeting with the team? How many times you're doing one on ones? How will you know how well oiled is your communication cadence are people talking as much as they should be is the quality, good, et cetera, et cetera. So it's all of those structures, rhythms, routines, and habits that you have in place that allow you to be successful. So that's a structural element, you've then got the cultural element, which then takes the people bit to the next level. Because even if you've got all of your roles filled, quite often, you have the wrong people in the wrong roles. And you've got cultural misalignment across the team, and so forth. So a lot of the work I do is around sort of how do we connect organizational purpose with individual purpose. And once you can do that, you can take care of your cultural layer. But we've all heard of that term culture eats strategy for breakfast. And we know how insidious it can be when you do have the wrong people on the table. And so being able to have a lens or have a focus on your cultural pillar, allows you to identify, okay, well, what's the thing that is going to help me be successful from a cultural perspective, I can see, you know, for a lot of people on this call, and a lot of my clients, sometimes the, the item, or the thing you have in the cultural pillar is actually just defining what you want your team culture to be. It doesn't need to be detailed, it may just be, you know, let's just figure out what that needs to be. So that's structural, that cult that's cultural. The final, the fifth and final pillar is the personal pillar, I said earlier, we all are all just humans. And we're all very busy humans that want big, fulfilled lives, and the personal pillar, or all those things we do outside of work that amplify our performance at work. It's the things that allow us to be who we want to be at work. So it might be, you know, for a lot of us, it's meditation, journaling, running, meditating, yoga, all of that stuff. But it might be things like, and this really, I think, came to the forefront of our minds last year, it might be dropping my kids off to school, twice a week, it might be having dinner, three nights a week, it might be going out on a date with my partner, once a week. So these are the things that if we are constantly doing and constantly keep our eye on, whilst we're working, that will keep us alive, and really keep our vitality up when it comes to high performance at work. So it's professional, financial, technical, cultural, structural, and personal. Five Pillars of high performance. And so if you think about, if you've got an eye on all of those things, and you can identify, what's the thing, so if we think come back to the 100 skills, or the four quadrants, how do they sit across those five pillars? That's how you know that you're doing what you need to do in order to become a CFO of influence, if

Richard Holmes
34:21
that's what you want. There you go. There you go. But that's just I was nodding my head along with me. I mean, it's just so logical, common sense, isn't it? Just again, guys, what's up awareness? Right? Yeah, this is what I do as part of the role Yeah. Where can I do better? Yeah, absolutely. And each one of their most was not gonna have forgets important. What's important, thoroughly important. The air I think it's talking about the Phillies here, you get them, get them on the go and throw it in the right direction.

Alena Bennett
34:58
Well, you know, and that Those of us that are listening to these to be pleased to know when I do this with my clients, we do it on a spreadsheet, we keep it simple, like who doesn't love a spreadsheet. But when you can keep it to a one page spreadsheet, then you just keep it front of mind, it's not complicated. If you feel like things are going to let you know a little bit off the tracks, you look at the spreadsheet and go, Oh, that's because you know, I'm going down this rabbit hole when actually I need to be known in this one thing. And we know that things do you know, fires do happen over the course of a quarter. But I think again, it comes back to that awareness is if you get stuck in that fire too long, and you don't have anything for you out. That's when you get in trouble. But when you've got your five pillars, it allows you to gives you that gives you that tangible thing that allows you to lift through, it's so hard to see craziness and mess when you're in it. But if you've got something, a resource that you can turn to that can becomes really handy.

Richard Holmes
35:51
because things are visual, yeah, spreadsheets or whatever. Just it just helps you realize that and as we touched on before, I think we've we've touched on leadership by some amazing leaders. And when you meet them, they're just normal. People just care about people. Yeah, and treat people like you want to be treated. The sensorial is about simple and kind of measuring yourself over comprehensive. That's been really, really insightful. Lots to digest. And as I as I touched on earlier, we will put links to this, and I can highly recommend you follow us on LinkedIn. But while you're absolutely. In the book you're about to write through, and it gets the name of that what's called CFO of the future. So you're

Alena Bennett
36:40
actually not shared that publicly. So you have heard it here first. So be on the lookout for that.

Richard Holmes
36:45
And the book you've got already written, it's called meaning matters results beyond the numbers. Yes. And what was the purpose behind writing that book?

Alena Bennett
36:52
Great question that use the P word purpose, because it's actually about finding meaning. It's about purpose. So the reason why I wrote that book, and the thing that really was the catalyst was, I noticed, in my coaching sessions in my executive coaching sessions, my clients were very energized and motivated. And they were doing all of their actions as a result of the coaching sessions until they hit the milestone. And every single time my clients would hit the milestone, they would come to me the next coaching session. And I'd say to them, so that I, there's a bit of a pre work that happens there all my coaching sessions. But the final question in that pre work is, what are the three need three coordinates you need from the session? Don't answer that question. They come to the session, and I go, Okay, well, what where do we want the focus to be today?
37:37
Not really sure.

Alena Bennett
37:39
Except just done all this work? It's not I'm not really sure. And this happens so frequently, that I realized they were missing that bigger piece that meaning, what is the long term? What is this all for? Yeah. And so that was what really was the driving force behind this was, you know, what is the big purpose that ultimately work just forms a part off? And so the book really allows you to get what I call purpose integration, which is so which is ask yourself the question, what is your purpose in life? And then how does work contribute to that? That's a really scary question, because most finance professionals I work with have never asked themselves that question. The reason I thought about it, no, I've never even thought about it don't think they're allowed to, in fact, because they think purpose is this big, fluffy, esoteric thing, which has no place in a really tangible results oriented world. But what we've known now is that purpose has a massive place in the marketplace at the moment. We know that, you know, the biggest global investment firms, they are looking at intangible factors like purpose ESG factors when they go into making investment decisions. If we think about the demographic of the market, the demographic of the workforce, the young kids, they all want to work with and spend their money with purpose led companies. Right. And so I think this, this is a conversation that we need to we need to bring in i think that i think the young kids know it, I think I've got it, I think that the key is sort of that middle level of organizations do it at an organization level, but it's how do we cascade that idea of purpose and how it aligns, it integrates not only at the organization level, but next level down at the team level, and then being able to open up a dialogue around purpose at the individual level, I think once you've got that connection across three levels, you're, you're growing in this in the same direction. Right. And I think that's what we've seen over the course of the last 15 months is that those organizations that have been really anchored to purpose, and and genuinely across the organization operated with that sense of purpose. And those are the ones that have continued to thrive over the pandemic. Yes, their tactics may have changed. But fundamentally, their way of being and what they stood for, has remained unchanged. And we've seen those that that don't have that they're the ones that have really struggled so. So that was very long way of answering the question what the motivation

Richard Holmes
39:59
was I think to your point, though, I think we've purpose I think I think people inside the 30s 40s It's the first time in life where they've been asked that question, What's your purpose in your life? What would you be doing but for the younger folk coming through? That's a tough one all the time. Correct.

Alena Bennett
40:15
That's our age group initially.

Richard Holmes
40:18
Which we need to kind of rethink, I think, for, for him from a recruitment perspective, I know this podcast is about recruitment, but we do see that come up with younger, younger generation asking about the purpose. Yes. And then sometimes, as a recruiter, we have to then go back to our clients and discuss the purpose. That's right, and how we're going to answer this question kind of thing. It's always good to get our topic. Look, it's been a pleasure listening to you. I think what you do is fantastic. And hopefully it's been insightful for people listening and I'm sure we're gonna we're gonna have another podcast in the future.

Alena Bennett
40:53
Fantastic. Thank you for having me. was just a lot of fun.